Uploaded April 2026 | Updated September 2026, 1 week ago
Have you ever had a friend not text you back, and you’re certain that they’re mad at you? This is often a disruption in the process of mentalization: the ability to recognize that our thoughts and feelings might not be facts. Mentalization is a process we can all struggle with, but it’s particularly important for people who have Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD).
In this episode, I'm joined by psychotherapist and author Robert Drozek to discuss mentalization-based treatment (MBT) and the tools that can help us develop more flexibility and curiosity around our assumptions. Bob outlines the three common modes of mentalizing, explains how childhood experiences shape mentalization, and offers a map for building healthier ways of relating to our thoughts and feelings.
About our Guest: Robert Drozak is a clinical social worker, the clinical director of the Mentalization-Based Treatment Clinic at McLean Hospital, and a teaching associate in the Department of Psychiatry at Harvard Medical School. His new book, Mentalization: Utilizing Reflection to Heal from Borderline Personality Disorder, is the first book about Mentalization-Based Treatment aimed at a general audience.
Key Topics:
0:00 Intro: what is mentalization?
5:12 Ways mentalization can go wrong
13:25 Borderline Personality Disorder as a deficit in mentalization
22:13 How mentalization is shaped in childhood
27:15 [Sponsor] Sleep Reset
28:54 The alien self
32:23 Developing an MBT formulation
42:03 MBT in the therapy room
54:40 Challenging your beliefs and assumptions
1:11:21 How to get out of pretend mode
1:21:37 Addressing problems with interoception
1:30:00 Recap
Sponsors
Sleep Reset is offering a free 7-day trial, available only at thesleepreset.com/podcast. Start your first week of real, clinician-designed insomnia treatment tonight.
I'm not a clinician, and what I say on this channel should not be taken as medical advice.
Subscribe to Being Well on:
Apple Podcasts: podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/being-well-with-dr-rick-hanson/id1120885936
Spotify: open.spotify.com/show/5d87ZU1XY0fpdYNSEwXLVQ
Who Am I: I'm Forrest, the co-author of Resilient (amzn.to/3iXLerD) and host of the Being Well Podcast (apple.co/38ufGG0). I'm making videos focused on simplifying psychology, mental health, and personal growth.
Subscribe to Rick on YouTube: youtube.com/@RickHanson?sub_confirmation=1
Get Rick's Free Newsletters: rickhanson.com/writings/newsletters-from-dr-rick-hanson
Follow Rick Here:
🌍 rickhanson.com
📸 instagram.com/rickhansonphd
You can follow me here:
🎤 apple.co/38ufGG0
🌍 forresthanson.com
📸 instagram.com/f.hanson
Have you ever had a friend not text you back, and you’re certain that they’re mad at you? This is often a disruption in the process of mentalization: the ability to recognize that our thoughts and feelings might not be facts. Mentalization is a process we can all struggle with, but it’s particularly important for people who have Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD).
In this episode, I'm joined by psychotherapist and author Robert Drozek to discuss mentalization-based treatment (MBT) and the tools that can help us develop more flexibility and curiosity around our assumptions. Bob outlines the three common modes of mentalizing, explains how childhood experiences shape mentalization, and offers a map for building healthier ways of relating to our thoughts and feelings.
About our Guest: Robert Drozak is a clinical social worker, the clinical director of the Mentalization-Based Treatment Clinic at McLean Hospital, and a teaching associate in the Department of Psychiatry at Harvard Medical School. His new book, Mentalization: Utilizing Reflection to Heal from Borderline Personality Disorder, is the first book about Mentalization-Based Treatment aimed at a general audience.
Key Topics:
0:00 Intro: what is mentalization?
5:12 Ways mentalization can go wrong
13:25 Borderline Personality Disorder as a deficit in mentalization
22:13 How mentalization is shaped in childhood
27:15 [Sponsor] Sleep Reset
28:54 The alien self
32:23 Developing an MBT formulation
42:03 MBT in the therapy room
54:40 Challenging your beliefs and assumptions
1:11:21 How to get out of pretend mode
1:21:37 Addressing problems with interoception
1:30:00 Recap
Sponsors
Sleep Reset is offering a free 7-day trial, available only at thesleepreset.com/podcast. Start your first week of real, clinician-designed insomnia treatment tonight.
I'm not a clinician, and what I say on this channel should not be taken as medical advice.
Subscribe to Being Well on:
Apple Podcasts: podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/being-well-with-dr-rick-hanson/id1120885936
Spotify: open.spotify.com/show/5d87ZU1XY0fpdYNSEwXLVQ
Who Am I: I'm Forrest, the co-author of Resilient (amzn.to/3iXLerD) and host of the Being Well Podcast (apple.co/38ufGG0). I'm making videos focused on simplifying psychology, mental health, and personal growth.
Subscribe to Rick on YouTube: youtube.com/@RickHanson?sub_confirmation=1
Get Rick's Free Newsletters: rickhanson.com/writings/newsletters-from-dr-rick-hanson
Follow Rick Here:
🌍 rickhanson.com
📸 instagram.com/rickhansonphd
You can follow me here:
🎤 apple.co/38ufGG0
🌍 forresthanson.com
📸 instagram.com/f.hanson
