Uploaded January 2026 | Updated September 2026, 2 weeks ago
Recorded in Premier’s new London studios, John Nelson welcomes Rod Dreher for a wide-ranging conversation about freedom, faith, and the West’s growing spiritual hunger.
Drawing on his bestselling book Live Not By Lies, Dreher argues that today’s greatest threat is not Orwell-style tyranny but Huxley’s 'soft totalitarianism', a culture that trades liberty for comfort, safety, and approval. Together, they explore the cost of discipleship, why suffering still matters (from Solzhenitsyn to Bonhoeffer), and how “therapeutic” Christianity leaves believers unprepared for pressure and loss.
0:33 Orwell Vs Huxley: Our Future
2:00 The “Right To Be Unhappy”
3:49 Nick Cave: Grief To God
6:32 “If You Won’t Suffer…”
9:41 The Fake Gospel Exposed
12:04 Arrested For Silent Prayer
17:10 Loneliness Breeds Control
20:43 20k Youth Pilgrimage: Chartres
28:25 Gen Z: Occult to Atheism?
33:49 Chartres Ended My Atheism
Dreher also reflects on meeting Nick Cave, the search for transcendence, and why many young adults are moving from scepticism to spirituality, sometimes via the occult. He concludes by introducing themes from his new book Living in Wonder, calling Christians to recover beauty, liturgy, prayer, and a hopeful (not naïve) vision for the future.
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• Subscribe to the Unbelievable? podcast: https://www.premier.plus/unbelievable
• More shows, free eBook & newsletter: premierunbelievable.com
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Rod's substack
Rod's Books Live Not By Lies amzn.to/3YMkZdv, Living In Wonder amzn.to/4qZc98j
Recorded in Premier’s new London studios, John Nelson welcomes Rod Dreher for a wide-ranging conversation about freedom, faith, and the West’s growing spiritual hunger.
Drawing on his bestselling book Live Not By Lies, Dreher argues that today’s greatest threat is not Orwell-style tyranny but Huxley’s 'soft totalitarianism', a culture that trades liberty for comfort, safety, and approval. Together, they explore the cost of discipleship, why suffering still matters (from Solzhenitsyn to Bonhoeffer), and how “therapeutic” Christianity leaves believers unprepared for pressure and loss.
0:33 Orwell Vs Huxley: Our Future
2:00 The “Right To Be Unhappy”
3:49 Nick Cave: Grief To God
6:32 “If You Won’t Suffer…”
9:41 The Fake Gospel Exposed
12:04 Arrested For Silent Prayer
17:10 Loneliness Breeds Control
20:43 20k Youth Pilgrimage: Chartres
28:25 Gen Z: Occult to Atheism?
33:49 Chartres Ended My Atheism
Dreher also reflects on meeting Nick Cave, the search for transcendence, and why many young adults are moving from scepticism to spirituality, sometimes via the occult. He concludes by introducing themes from his new book Living in Wonder, calling Christians to recover beauty, liturgy, prayer, and a hopeful (not naïve) vision for the future.
• Support us: premierunbelievable.com/geolink/donate
• Subscribe to the Unbelievable? podcast: https://www.premier.plus/unbelievable
• More shows, free eBook & newsletter: premierunbelievable.com
- Facebook: facebook.com/PremierUnbelievable
- Instagram: instagram.com/premierunbelievable
- TikTok: tiktok.com/@premierunbelievable
- X (Twitter) https://x.com/unbelievablefe
- Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/unbelievablefe.bsky.social
Rod's substack
Rod's Books Live Not By Lies amzn.to/3YMkZdv, Living In Wonder amzn.to/4qZc98j
