Uploaded January 2026 | Updated September 2026, 8 hours ago
Dr. Judith Curry, a climatologist known for her criticism of alarmist doomsday rhetoric about climate change, returns to STEM-Talk for her second appearance.
Curry was one of five researchers commissioned by the Department of Energy last year to draft a Climate Assessment Report summarizing the current state of climate science, particularly with a focus on how it relates to the United States. In Curry’s interview today, episode 190, STEM-Talk host Ken Ford has a conversation with Curry about the climate report’s key points, including the finding that carbon-dioxide induced warming of the planet appears to be less damaging economically than has been commonly believed.
The report, which was released this past summer, also argues that aggressive mitigation strategies for carbon dioxide emissions could be more harmful than helpful.
Today’s interview, which is now available on podcast apps, YouTube and on IHMC’s website, comes on the heels of the prestigious journal Nature retracting a study that predicted climate change and carbon emissions would cause catastrophic economic damage by the end of the century. Curry’s interview also follows an about-face from Microsoft co-founder Bill Gates who wrote a memo back in October arguing it’s time to tamp down the alarmist rhetoric that climate change will lead to humanity’s demise.
In today’s interview, Ford and Curry discuss:
How Curry became one of five researchers handpicked by Energy Secretary Chris Wright to summarize the current state of climate science.
The climate report’s finding that the economic damage from carbon dioxide-induced warming is less severe than is commonly believed.
The need to redirect climate science away from alarmism toward a better understanding of natural climate variability.
The difficulty that’s involved in linking specific extreme weather events like hurricanes to climate change.
A paper Curry co-wrote titled “A critique of the apocalyptic climate narrative.”
Bill Gates’ pivot away from policies urging net-zero emissions.
Pushback following the release of the climate report, including the criticism that the report is a “rats’ nest of bad arguments.”
The American Meteorological Society response titled “Five Fundamental Flaws in the Department of Energy’s 2025 Climate Report.”
Curry’s view that “climate alarmism fatigue” is becoming more prevalent.
Curry is president of the Climate Forecast Application Network and host of the blog, Climate Etc, which you can find at JudithCurry.com. Her blog provides a forum for climate researchers, academics and technical experts from other fields as well as citizen scientists to discuss topics related to climate science and science policy.
Her research interests include hurricanes, remote sensing, atmospheric modeling, polar climates, air-sea interactions, climate models, and the use of unmanned aerial vehicles for atmospheric research. She has published more than a hundred scientific papers and is the author of “Climate Change and Uncertainty: Rethinking Our Response,” a book that provides a framework for understanding and rethinking the climate-change debate.
STEM-Talk is an award-winning podcast from the Florida Institute for Human and Machine Cognition that hosts conversations with the leading minds in science and technology. Listen on your favorite platform or browse our library at ihmc.us/stemtalks
Dr. Judith Curry, a climatologist known for her criticism of alarmist doomsday rhetoric about climate change, returns to STEM-Talk for her second appearance.
Curry was one of five researchers commissioned by the Department of Energy last year to draft a Climate Assessment Report summarizing the current state of climate science, particularly with a focus on how it relates to the United States. In Curry’s interview today, episode 190, STEM-Talk host Ken Ford has a conversation with Curry about the climate report’s key points, including the finding that carbon-dioxide induced warming of the planet appears to be less damaging economically than has been commonly believed.
The report, which was released this past summer, also argues that aggressive mitigation strategies for carbon dioxide emissions could be more harmful than helpful.
Today’s interview, which is now available on podcast apps, YouTube and on IHMC’s website, comes on the heels of the prestigious journal Nature retracting a study that predicted climate change and carbon emissions would cause catastrophic economic damage by the end of the century. Curry’s interview also follows an about-face from Microsoft co-founder Bill Gates who wrote a memo back in October arguing it’s time to tamp down the alarmist rhetoric that climate change will lead to humanity’s demise.
In today’s interview, Ford and Curry discuss:
How Curry became one of five researchers handpicked by Energy Secretary Chris Wright to summarize the current state of climate science.
The climate report’s finding that the economic damage from carbon dioxide-induced warming is less severe than is commonly believed.
The need to redirect climate science away from alarmism toward a better understanding of natural climate variability.
The difficulty that’s involved in linking specific extreme weather events like hurricanes to climate change.
A paper Curry co-wrote titled “A critique of the apocalyptic climate narrative.”
Bill Gates’ pivot away from policies urging net-zero emissions.
Pushback following the release of the climate report, including the criticism that the report is a “rats’ nest of bad arguments.”
The American Meteorological Society response titled “Five Fundamental Flaws in the Department of Energy’s 2025 Climate Report.”
Curry’s view that “climate alarmism fatigue” is becoming more prevalent.
Curry is president of the Climate Forecast Application Network and host of the blog, Climate Etc, which you can find at JudithCurry.com. Her blog provides a forum for climate researchers, academics and technical experts from other fields as well as citizen scientists to discuss topics related to climate science and science policy.
Her research interests include hurricanes, remote sensing, atmospheric modeling, polar climates, air-sea interactions, climate models, and the use of unmanned aerial vehicles for atmospheric research. She has published more than a hundred scientific papers and is the author of “Climate Change and Uncertainty: Rethinking Our Response,” a book that provides a framework for understanding and rethinking the climate-change debate.
STEM-Talk is an award-winning podcast from the Florida Institute for Human and Machine Cognition that hosts conversations with the leading minds in science and technology. Listen on your favorite platform or browse our library at ihmc.us/stemtalks
![Episode 180: Pascal Lee on NASA’s ambitions to send humans to the Moon and Mars
Today we have planetary scientist Dr. Pascal Lee and STEM-Talk host Dr. Ken Ford in a wide-ranging conversation about NASA’s ambitions to return humans to the Moon as a stepping stone to sending astronauts to Mars.
Pascal is making his third appearance on STEM-Talk. Much of his research focuses on asteroids, impact craters, and the future human exploration of Mars. Pascal and Ken have a lively discussion about the growing momentum for space exploration.
Pascal is a researcher at the SETI Institute, a not-for-profit NASA program focused on searching for extraterrestrial intelligence in an effort to understand and explain the origin and nature of life in the universe. He also is the co-founder and chairman of the Mars Institute, and director of the Haughton-Mars Project at NASA Ames Research Center.
Last year, Pascal received significant news coverage for his discovery of a giant volcano along with a possible sheet of buried glacier ice in the eastern part of Mars’ Tharsis volcanic province. This was the first geological find of this magnitude since the other major volcanos on Mars were discovered back in the 1970s.
Show notes:
[00:03:06] Ken welcomes Pascal back to STEM-Talk and starts our interview by mentioning the developments in space exploration over the past few years, including civilian space missions, NASA’s Artemis program which aims to send humans back to the moon, and commitments to a manned mission to Mars. Given Pascal’s career in advancement of space exploration, Ken asks if Pascal is excited by these recent developments.
[00:04:43] Ken explains that for a couple of decades Pascal has spent his summers visiting Devon Island in the Canadian arctic archipelago, which is the largest uninhabited land on Earth. When Pascal was last on STEM-Talk, his annual trip to Devon Island was cancelled due to COVID-19. Devon Island has unique geological characteristics that are in some ways similar to those on Mars. Since 2001, Devon Isalnd has been the home of the Haughton Mars Project (HMP). Ken asks Pascal to talk about the advances in this project since his last appearance on STEM-Talk.
[00:07:59] Ken mentions that while much conversation has been centered on a human trip to Mars, a mission to return humans to the Moon and establish a permanent base is a more immediately feasible goal in the short term. Ken asks Pascal to talk about the importance and significance of such a mission.
[00:12:06] On the topic of a Moon base, Ken explains that NASA’s Artemis project aims to send humans to the south pole of the Moon. Pascal has written a paper on that topic titled “An Off-Polar Site Option for the NASA Artemis Space Camp (https://isdc.nss.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/07/ISDC-2024-Moon-2001-Lee-Clavius-FINAL.pdf) .” Ken asks Pascal what he sees as the primary weakness in the south pole location.
[00:20:25] Ken agrees with Pascal’s perspective on sending humans to the lunar south pole, and the two discuss the problems with focusing human space exploration on romantic ideas such as “living off the land.”
[00:22:24] Ken follows up on the previous questions by mentioning that in Pascal’s aforementioned paper, he suggests setting up a lunar base at the floor of the Clavius crater. Ken asks Pascal to talk about Clavius and why it is a potentially good permanent location for a moon base.
[00:27:56] Ken asks Pascal how confident he and the community at large is in the Sophia finding of water.
[00:29:00] Ken notes that contemporary interest in human space exploration appears tied to current geopolitical issues, much like the first space race between the US and USSR. Today, interest in space travel is closely linked with relations between the US and China. Ken asks Pascal to discuss this and how he believes the US should view this current situation.
[00:35:43] Ken asks Pascal what he knows about the China’s current plans for a lunar mission.
[00:34:36] Ken talks about a meeting at IHMC that addressed power-beaming to the lunar surface.
[00:39:01] Ken notes that there is a lot of talk these days about not not only traveling to Mars, but also colonizing Mars. Ken asks Pascal where he believes this sentiment is coming from and what are some of the challenges associated with colonizing Mars.
[00:46:48] Ken notes that last year Elon Musk made an announcement to his SpaceX employees that he expects 1 million people to be living on Mars in the next 20 years. Ken asks Pascal what his thoughts are on this.
[00:53:28] Ken asks Pascal to talk about a paper he published discussing a previously unrecognized volcano on Mars. Given that it was generally accepted for decades that all the volcanos had been accounted for, Ken asks Pascal to talk about the story of his recent discovery.
[01:02:44] Ken pivots to a discussion of the Moons of Mars, specifically Phobos, asking Pascal to talk about the nature of this Moon.
[01:07:42] Ken mentions that docking on Phobos and then going from... Episode 180: Pascal Lee on NASA’s ambitions to send humans to the Moon and Mars](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/NjUStiDa5bg/mqdefault.jpg)


![Episode 191: Francisco Gonzalez-Lima discusses methylene blue & noninvasive human brain stimulation
Today we have Dr. Francisco Gonzalez-Lima, a behavioral neuroscientist who was our guest in episodes 106 (https://www.ihmc.us/stemtalk/episode-106/) and 107 (https://www.ihmc.us/stemtalk/episode-107/) back in 2020.
Since those 2020 interviews, Francisco and his colleagues at the Gonzalez-Lima Lab have produced dozens of more studies and papers that have advanced their work on methylene blue, transcranial lasers, memory enhancement, neuroprotection and neurocognitive disorders.
Francisco and his lab at the University of Texas Austin are recognized as world leaders for their research on the relationships between brain energy metabolism, memory and neurobehavioral disorders.
In today’s interview, we talk to Francisco about his lab’s most recent research on the beneficial neurocognitive and emotional effects of noninvasive human brain stimulation in healthy, aging and mentally ill populations. This research primarily uses transcranial infrared laser stimulation and multimodal imaging, which we will discuss in today’s interview.
Be sure to check out our earlier interviews with Francisco where he talked aobut his work on brain metabolic mapping and Alzheimer’s, episode 106 (https://www.ihmc.us/stemtalk/episode-106/) , and his research into methylene blue and near-infrared light as therapies for cognitive disorders, episode 107 (https://www.ihmc.us/stemtalk/episode-107/) .
Show notes:
[00:04:32] Dawn and Ken open our interview with Francisco by mentioning that his lab has been very productive pursuing new research avenues since he was last on STEM-Talk. Ken mentions that Francisco has recently begun collaborating with his sister who has a PhD in computational and applied mathematics and asks Francisco to talk about the work they’re doing together.
[00:06:21] Dawn shifts to talk about the roadblocks that Francisco and his team have been dealing with, particularly that the review process for academic papers is unusually slow, not just for Francisco’s team but at large. Dawn asks Francisco to discuss this issue.
[00:10:37] Dawn recaps that in our previous interview with Francisco in 2020, the discussion focused on his research into methylene blue, which has been primarily used to treat methemoglobinemia, however, the potential for methylene blue to treat declining cognitive function is an active area of research. Despite Francisco’s successful work with methylene blue, he often gets asked about its safety, largely due to various misconceptions. Dawn asks Francisco to talk about the misconceptions about methylene blue.
[00:14:57] Ken asks if Francisco what some other misconceptions about methylene blue are.
[00:20:43] Given the discussion of dosing, Ken asks Francisco what the safe dose range is for methylene blue in humans.
[00:28:15] Ken mentions an article published a few months ago titled “Beyond plaques: How methylene blue and ketones address vascular hypometabolism in Alzheimer’s disease” (https://www.gethealthspan.com/research/article/beyond-plaques-methylene-blue-ketones-vascular-hypometabolism?srsltid=AfmBOoqpTkxzRevn-X6g5xsop3QXbX5dvgPTdFLrZUIU0O2lE8XD0iJA) Ken goes on to mention that the article did a good job of summarizing Francisco’s work as well as the work of Steve Cunnane, who was our guest on episode 59. Ken asks Francisco to discuss his thoughts on the article.
[00:34:25] Dawn shifts focus to discuss Francisco’s work on photobiomodulation, specifically transcranial infrared laser stimulation, which is a non-invasive method for neuroprotection and cognitive enhancement. Dawn explains that Francisco has written two chapters on this topic that summarizes his work in the area, one of which appeared in the Oxford handbook on transcranial stimulation, and the other is in a book on augmentation of brain function, based on a series of presentations he gave in Switzerland. Dawn asks Francisco to give a broad overview of his work on photobiomodulation and transcranial infrared laser stimulation.
[00:43:52] Ken asks Francisco to talk about a paper titled “Light buckets and laser beams” (https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC12181550/) that he and other researchers composed after attending a photobiomodulation workshop convened in 2023 by the director of the National Institute on Aging and several NIH lab directors.
[00:51:25] Ken asks Francisco if there are any commercially available photobiomodulation devices that he thinks have substantial utility.
[00:56:27] Ken asks Francisco to discuss mitochondrial disfunction in the context of neurodegeneration and his work on targeted stimulation of the mitochondria with photo biomodulation.
[01:06:58] Ken asks Francisco to talk about the potential benefits of photobiomodulation on the aging process outside of neurodegenerative conditions.
[01:17:16] Dawn mentions that transcranial infrared stimulation stimulates prefrontal energy metabolism and oxygenation, which produces cognitive enhancing effects. Dawn go... Episode 191: Francisco Gonzalez-Lima discusses methylene blue & noninvasive human brain stimulation](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Odv44IlR1iQ/mqdefault.jpg)





![Episode 195: Doug Cooke discusses NASA’s challenges in the space race to the Moon and Mars
Our guest today is Doug Cooke, an aerospace consultant who spent 38 years at NASA’s Johnson Space Center in Houston and NASA Headquarters in Washington, D.C.
STEM-Talk host and IHMC founder Dr. Ken Ford, a former Associate Director of NASA’s Ames Research Center and Director of NASA’s Center of Excellence in Information Technology, interviewed Doug just four days after the astronauts of NASA’s Artemis II mission splashed down in the Pacific Ocean following a historic 10-day roundtrip from the Earth to the Moon.
In today’s episode, Ken and Doug discuss the Artemis mission as well as NASA’s plans to return humans to the lunar surface by 2028. Doug also shares his concern that China could one day surpass America’s leadership role in human spaceflight.
During his 38 years at NASA, Doug played critical roles in the Space Shuttle, International Space Station and Human Exploration spaceflight programs. During the last three years of his NASA career, he served as Associate Administrator of the Exploration Systems Mission Directorate, which oversees the development of systems critical to NASA’s plans for human exploration of the Moon and Mars, including the Artemis program.
Show notes:
[00:04:05] Ken opens our interview with Doug by talking about the Artemis II mission, which is the first crewed mission beyond low earth orbit since Apollo 17 in 1972. Harrison Schmidtt, who was on Apollo 17, was our guest on episode 4 (https://www.ihmc.us/stemtalk/episode004/) . Ken asks Doug for his key takeaways of the Artemis II mission, which set the record for a manned mission from Earth, traveling 252,756 miles into space and breaking Apollo 13’s record.
[00:06:18] Ken explains that the Artemis missions signal a new age of space exploration as well as the beginning of a new space race between the U.S. and China. NASA aims to land humans on the Moon by 2028 while China expects to land humans on the moon in 2030. Ken has previously stated that he does not have confidence in NASA’s current mission architecture to achieve NASA’s stated goal of 2028, and asks Doug for his thoughts on the matter.
[00:07:28] Ken asks if it is true that Yuri Gagarin, who become the first human to fly into space, is what initially sparked Doug’s interest in science and space.
[00:08:54] Ken notes that Gagarin’s orbit around the earth inspired President Kennedy to vow that the United States would ramp up its space program and become the first nation to land a man on the moon. Ken mentions that he believes the Apollo 11 mission, which landed astronauts Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin on the lunar surface, was one the greatest technological advances in world history. Ken asks Doug for his thoughts on the success of the Apollo program.
[00:10:28] Ken mentions that Doug went to college at Texas A&M and majored in aerospace engineering. Kens asks Doug how he got a job at NASA after graduating.
[00:12:21] Ken explains that Doug was instrumental in the development of the space shuttle and the International Space Station during his time at NASA. Doug talks about what it was like working on those projects at NASA.
[00:15:16] Ken mentions that Doug also had an instrumental role in the Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter (LRO), Lunar Crater Observation and Sensing Satellite (LCROSS), and the broader Exploration Technology Program. Ken points out that Doug became head of the exploration technology program in 1990 under then NASA Associate Administrator Mike Griffin, who was our guest on episodes 134 (https://www.ihmc.us/stemtalk/episode-134/) and 189 (https://www.ihmc.us/stemtalk/episode-189/) . Ken asks Doug about meeting Mike.
[00:16:17] Ken mentions that Mike Griffin and Lisa Porter were our guests on episode 189 (https://www.ihmc.us/stemtalk/episode-189/) , where they voiced concerns about NASA’s current plans for a return to the moon. Ken goes on to mention that near the end of Doug’s career at NASA, he was the head of Exploration Systems Mission Directorate (ESMD), which is responsible for the development of systems critical to NASA’s plans for future exploration of the Moon and Mars. Ken asks Doug to talk about his role as head of the directorate and the work he did there.
[00:18:55] Ken explains that Doug has written extensively on the issues with the Artemis mission architecture, most notably in a recent article for space news (https://spacenews.com/the-u-s-race-to-the-moon-why-plan-b-cannot-wait/) . Before jumping into the article, Ken asks Doug to talk about why it is important and also a national-security concern that we return to the moon before China.
[00:21:12] Looping back to Doug’s op-ed in Space News (https://spacenews.com/the-u-s-race-to-the-moon-why-plan-b-cannot-wait/) , Ken notes that Doug stressed the need for NASA to develop a plan-B for the Artemis mission, with Doug and others noting that without a plan-B, the U.S. risks of losing the space race to the Moon. Doug has also gone on record to say that Chi... Episode 195: Doug Cooke discusses NASA’s challenges in the space race to the Moon and Mars](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/SHB7o6gBEb4/mqdefault.jpg)
