Sentientism | "Animal research... much harm with very little benefit" - Neuroscientist Dr Katherine Roe - Ep: 147 @Sentientism | Uploaded March 2023 | Updated October 2024, 7 hours ago.
Katherine (sentientism.info/sentientist-pledge/katherine-roe) is chief of Science Advancement and Outreach (SAO) at @peta (People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals). SAO aims to change the paradigm of biomedical research by promoting the development & implementation of cutting-edge strategies in biomedical research & training & eliminating the use of animals in experimentation. Katherine earned her bachelor’s degrees in biology & psychology from Syracuse University & her Ph.D. in experimental psychology and cognitive science from the University of California–San Diego. After completing a postdoctoral fellowship at Johns Hopkins University, she went on to become a research fellow at the National Institute of Mental Health, where she stayed for eight years. Over the course of her research career, she studied the neural correlates of linguistic, spatial, & memory processes, working with children with early focal brain injury, adults & children with schizophrenia, & individuals with Williams syndrome & related genetic disorders. Katherine has more than 20 years of experience conducting brain & neuroimaging research with humans & is an expert at experimental design & data analysis. She has been published in numerous peer-reviewed journals & has presented her findings at national & international industry conferences.
In Sentientist Conversations we talk about the two most important questions: “what’s real?” & “what matters?”
Sentientism is "evidence, reason & compassion for all sentient beings." The audio is on our Podcast: apple.co/391khQO & https://anchor.fm/sentientism.
We discuss:
00:00 Welcome
01:29 Katherine's Intro - from neuroscience and the NIH to PETA
- "About half of biomedical research... involves very invasive procedures with animals"
- "It became clear to me that that assumption... that the harms we were doing were justifiable... fell apart... the harms were much greater than I realised but also... there's a lot of species differences that make data from these labs difficult to translate into benefits for humans."
- "Then the question becomes... well what are we doing?"
- "Trying to make sure people realise how sentient these animals really are... they have their own needs & wants & desires"
- Previous episodes with Ingrid Newkirk youtu.be/M7Ac2Ba2jbM & Aysha Akhtar youtu.be/EZ_gh0ldzpo
04:55 What's Real?
- "Religious but not deeply religious" parents - Anglican, episcopalian Christians
- "It never really took"
- Not needing external reasons for "wanting to cause as little harm as possible and to live in harmony with the world around us"
- Learning about animals through science "started to change the way I viewed them"
- Starting with food - then questioning zoos, horse racing & much later scientific research
- "I don't think of myself as religious today"
- Unitarian if anything... the principles that are consistent across & beyond religions
- "I would love for something more supernaturalistic to take place in my own life"
- Open minded about things science can't (yet) explain
- The comfort of believing there's someone out there that cares about us
- Problems with science "scientists - all of them - are fallible... the pressure to publish"
- Retractions, corrections, fraud, replication failures
- "Many scientists have lost sight of their original goal... to get accurate answers"
- "Scientific integrity is in a crisis"
- "That's what science is - it's supposed to constantly evolve"
- Denial, scepticism, gullibility (to grifters on YouTube)
- Critical judgement & assessing sources
- Polarisation
- Science needs to be "treating the public as intelligent". Honest & transparent. Not over-simplifying
- Provisional & probabilistic credences (vs. binary beliefs)
- @dailymail 's awful "X causes cancer... X cures cancer" pattern
24:54 What & Who Matters?
- "Increasing your circle of empathy to include everyone and everything..."
- "Every animal who feels pain or fear or can suffer matters... every person matters"
- "Humans... tend to consider ourselves the superior species... & that everything around us is here for us... instead of being here with us"
- "There's always a consequence... every decision you make doesn't just impact you"
- Compassion & thoughtfulness
- JW Concerns about #teleology "we're all here for a purpose... us humans normally assume that we're the point!"
- "Part of an intricate network... interacting with the purposes of those around you."
- "Reject this notion that humans are the purpose"
- "Our capabilities... may be different - but they're not superior"
- #sentience as a justification "most people can understand"
46:49 How Can We Make a Better Future?
... & much more!
#Sentientism is “Evidence, reason & compassion for all #sentient beings.” More at sentientism.info/. Join our "I'm a Sentientist" wall sentientism.info/wall/.
Everyone, Sentientist or not, is welcome in our groups. E.g.: facebook.com/groups/sentientism.
Katherine (sentientism.info/sentientist-pledge/katherine-roe) is chief of Science Advancement and Outreach (SAO) at @peta (People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals). SAO aims to change the paradigm of biomedical research by promoting the development & implementation of cutting-edge strategies in biomedical research & training & eliminating the use of animals in experimentation. Katherine earned her bachelor’s degrees in biology & psychology from Syracuse University & her Ph.D. in experimental psychology and cognitive science from the University of California–San Diego. After completing a postdoctoral fellowship at Johns Hopkins University, she went on to become a research fellow at the National Institute of Mental Health, where she stayed for eight years. Over the course of her research career, she studied the neural correlates of linguistic, spatial, & memory processes, working with children with early focal brain injury, adults & children with schizophrenia, & individuals with Williams syndrome & related genetic disorders. Katherine has more than 20 years of experience conducting brain & neuroimaging research with humans & is an expert at experimental design & data analysis. She has been published in numerous peer-reviewed journals & has presented her findings at national & international industry conferences.
In Sentientist Conversations we talk about the two most important questions: “what’s real?” & “what matters?”
Sentientism is "evidence, reason & compassion for all sentient beings." The audio is on our Podcast: apple.co/391khQO & https://anchor.fm/sentientism.
We discuss:
00:00 Welcome
01:29 Katherine's Intro - from neuroscience and the NIH to PETA
- "About half of biomedical research... involves very invasive procedures with animals"
- "It became clear to me that that assumption... that the harms we were doing were justifiable... fell apart... the harms were much greater than I realised but also... there's a lot of species differences that make data from these labs difficult to translate into benefits for humans."
- "Then the question becomes... well what are we doing?"
- "Trying to make sure people realise how sentient these animals really are... they have their own needs & wants & desires"
- Previous episodes with Ingrid Newkirk youtu.be/M7Ac2Ba2jbM & Aysha Akhtar youtu.be/EZ_gh0ldzpo
04:55 What's Real?
- "Religious but not deeply religious" parents - Anglican, episcopalian Christians
- "It never really took"
- Not needing external reasons for "wanting to cause as little harm as possible and to live in harmony with the world around us"
- Learning about animals through science "started to change the way I viewed them"
- Starting with food - then questioning zoos, horse racing & much later scientific research
- "I don't think of myself as religious today"
- Unitarian if anything... the principles that are consistent across & beyond religions
- "I would love for something more supernaturalistic to take place in my own life"
- Open minded about things science can't (yet) explain
- The comfort of believing there's someone out there that cares about us
- Problems with science "scientists - all of them - are fallible... the pressure to publish"
- Retractions, corrections, fraud, replication failures
- "Many scientists have lost sight of their original goal... to get accurate answers"
- "Scientific integrity is in a crisis"
- "That's what science is - it's supposed to constantly evolve"
- Denial, scepticism, gullibility (to grifters on YouTube)
- Critical judgement & assessing sources
- Polarisation
- Science needs to be "treating the public as intelligent". Honest & transparent. Not over-simplifying
- Provisional & probabilistic credences (vs. binary beliefs)
- @dailymail 's awful "X causes cancer... X cures cancer" pattern
24:54 What & Who Matters?
- "Increasing your circle of empathy to include everyone and everything..."
- "Every animal who feels pain or fear or can suffer matters... every person matters"
- "Humans... tend to consider ourselves the superior species... & that everything around us is here for us... instead of being here with us"
- "There's always a consequence... every decision you make doesn't just impact you"
- Compassion & thoughtfulness
- JW Concerns about #teleology "we're all here for a purpose... us humans normally assume that we're the point!"
- "Part of an intricate network... interacting with the purposes of those around you."
- "Reject this notion that humans are the purpose"
- "Our capabilities... may be different - but they're not superior"
- #sentience as a justification "most people can understand"
46:49 How Can We Make a Better Future?
... & much more!
#Sentientism is “Evidence, reason & compassion for all #sentient beings.” More at sentientism.info/. Join our "I'm a Sentientist" wall sentientism.info/wall/.
Everyone, Sentientist or not, is welcome in our groups. E.g.: facebook.com/groups/sentientism.
