Uploaded May 2025 | Updated September 2026, 33 minutes ago
Who was the indispensable man in America's founding: George Washington or Thomas Jefferson?
In this captivating, fast-paced debate, Clay Jenkinson—renowned Jefferson interpreter and creator of Listening to America—faces off against Dr. Lindsay Chervinsky, award-winning historian and author of The Cabinet. Together, they dive into an energetic discussion about vision, leadership, military legacy, democracy, slavery, architecture, agriculture, and the soul of the American experiment. The result is as entertaining as it is enlightening.
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Expect sharp insights, biting humor, and a crowd that literally changes its vote by the end of the night. Whether you're a student of history or just love a good intellectual throwdown, this debate delivers. From Jefferson's Enlightenment dreams and Louisiana Purchase to Washington’s military genius and presidential restraint, every angle is examined—and nothing is held back.
Catch this special session live from Vail, packed with passionate arguments, real-time audience polling, and a rare on-stage meeting of two friends and podcast collaborators. Which founding father would you vote for?
Dr. Lindsay Chervinsky is an accomplished historian and the Executive Director of the George Washington Presidential Library. She is the author of The Cabinet: George Washington and the Creation of an American Institution, an award-winning book that redefined how we understand the presidency. Her latest work, Making the Presidency: John Adams and the Presidents that Forged the Republic, highlights the evolution of executive power in the early republic. A regular contributor to the Wall Street Journal, Time, and CNN, Lindsay is a dynamic voice in public history and a rising star in the field of American political scholarship.
Clay Jenkinson is one of the nation’s leading humanities scholars and historical interpreters, best known for his award-winning portrayal of Thomas Jefferson. A Rhodes Scholar and recipient of the National Humanities Medal, Clay is the creator and host of Listening to America, a popular podcast that explores American identity and democratic ideals. He is the author of several influential books, including Becoming Jefferson’s People and Repairing Jefferson’s America, and is widely regarded for bringing history to life with insight, wit, and a deep understanding of Enlightenment thought.
Who was the indispensable man in America's founding: George Washington or Thomas Jefferson?
In this captivating, fast-paced debate, Clay Jenkinson—renowned Jefferson interpreter and creator of Listening to America—faces off against Dr. Lindsay Chervinsky, award-winning historian and author of The Cabinet. Together, they dive into an energetic discussion about vision, leadership, military legacy, democracy, slavery, architecture, agriculture, and the soul of the American experiment. The result is as entertaining as it is enlightening.
Please like, subscribe and click the bell icon above to get notifications when we post new videos!
Join our mailing list to get advance info on our upcoming programs and to sign up for livestreams: signup.e2ma.net/signup/1887647/1895526
We rely on our donors to keep our programming going, please donate here: vailsymposium.org/donate
Expect sharp insights, biting humor, and a crowd that literally changes its vote by the end of the night. Whether you're a student of history or just love a good intellectual throwdown, this debate delivers. From Jefferson's Enlightenment dreams and Louisiana Purchase to Washington’s military genius and presidential restraint, every angle is examined—and nothing is held back.
Catch this special session live from Vail, packed with passionate arguments, real-time audience polling, and a rare on-stage meeting of two friends and podcast collaborators. Which founding father would you vote for?
Dr. Lindsay Chervinsky is an accomplished historian and the Executive Director of the George Washington Presidential Library. She is the author of The Cabinet: George Washington and the Creation of an American Institution, an award-winning book that redefined how we understand the presidency. Her latest work, Making the Presidency: John Adams and the Presidents that Forged the Republic, highlights the evolution of executive power in the early republic. A regular contributor to the Wall Street Journal, Time, and CNN, Lindsay is a dynamic voice in public history and a rising star in the field of American political scholarship.
Clay Jenkinson is one of the nation’s leading humanities scholars and historical interpreters, best known for his award-winning portrayal of Thomas Jefferson. A Rhodes Scholar and recipient of the National Humanities Medal, Clay is the creator and host of Listening to America, a popular podcast that explores American identity and democratic ideals. He is the author of several influential books, including Becoming Jefferson’s People and Repairing Jefferson’s America, and is widely regarded for bringing history to life with insight, wit, and a deep understanding of Enlightenment thought.
