khanpadawan | trinities 280 - Have yourself an Incarnation-free Christmas @khanpadawan | Uploaded December 2019 | Updated October 2024, 30 minutes ago.
trinities.org/blog/podcast-280-have-yourself-an-incarnation-free-christmas Two of the four gospels contain accounts of Jesus’s birth. Does either of them portray Jesus as “becoming Incarnate” – in other words, having always been divine, he becomes human when Mary becomes pregnant with him? Do they teach that an eternal divine Person came to earth from heaven? That a divine nature “assumed a complete human nature, body and soul”?
In this episode we look for the sorts of ideas that would indicate that the gospels according to Matthew and Luke are committed to the Incarnation of Jesus. We’d expect to see some reference to (1) a before-state, where he is only divine, not human, (2) the transition, when he becomes incarnate, and (3) the after-state, where he is both divine and human, a godman, God in human baby form.
What if we don’t find any such ideas in the Jesus-origin-stories in Matthew and Luke? What then should we conclude about their christological commitments?
I discuss this inconsistent triad of claims. It seems that a thinking Christian ought to deny one of these claims.
The New Testament gospels agree in their core claims about Jesus and God.
Matthew, Mark, and Luke don’t teach that the pre-human Jesus voluntarily assumed a complete human nature in order to save us.
John teaches that the pre-human Jesus voluntarily assumed a complete human nature in order to save us.
Which do you deny, and why?
Links for this episode @ trinities.org/blog/podcast-280-have-yourself-an-incarnation-free-christmas
podcast 67 – Is Christmas a pagan holiday?
podcast 235 – The Case Against Preexistence
Clarifying Catholic Christologies
Christmas Amazement
World Religions 4a Hindu doctrines, schools, and history – Brahman, atman, and reincarnation
Birth of Krishna
a baby god – Ram (avatar of the god Vishnu) from Ramayana episode 1
World Religions 6a Life of the Buddha, Buddhist History – the life of Gautama part 1
Matthew 1-2; Luke 1-3; John 1; Philippians 2:5-7.
a reading of Philippians 2:5-11
Brown, The Birth of the Messiah
podcast 128 – Ehrman and Bird on How Jesus Became God – Part 1
podcast 227 – Who Should Christians Worship?
This week’s thinking music is “O Come All Ye Faithful (Adeste Fideles)” by the Canterbury Choir.
Weekly podcast exploring views about the Trinity, and more generally about God and Jesus in Christian theology and philosophy. Debates, interviews, and historical and contemporary perspectives. Hosted by philosopher of religion / analytic theologian Dr. Dale Tuggy.
This week's thinking music is "O Come All Ye Faithful (Adeste Fideles)" by the Canterbury Choir. archive.org/details/78_o-come-all-ye-faithful-adeste-fideles_the-canterbury-choir-macklin-marrow-ernest_gbia0006856a/O+Come+All+Ye+Faithful+(Adeste+Fide+-+The+Canterbury+Choir.flac
trinities.org/blog/podcast-280-have-yourself-an-incarnation-free-christmas Two of the four gospels contain accounts of Jesus’s birth. Does either of them portray Jesus as “becoming Incarnate” – in other words, having always been divine, he becomes human when Mary becomes pregnant with him? Do they teach that an eternal divine Person came to earth from heaven? That a divine nature “assumed a complete human nature, body and soul”?
In this episode we look for the sorts of ideas that would indicate that the gospels according to Matthew and Luke are committed to the Incarnation of Jesus. We’d expect to see some reference to (1) a before-state, where he is only divine, not human, (2) the transition, when he becomes incarnate, and (3) the after-state, where he is both divine and human, a godman, God in human baby form.
What if we don’t find any such ideas in the Jesus-origin-stories in Matthew and Luke? What then should we conclude about their christological commitments?
I discuss this inconsistent triad of claims. It seems that a thinking Christian ought to deny one of these claims.
The New Testament gospels agree in their core claims about Jesus and God.
Matthew, Mark, and Luke don’t teach that the pre-human Jesus voluntarily assumed a complete human nature in order to save us.
John teaches that the pre-human Jesus voluntarily assumed a complete human nature in order to save us.
Which do you deny, and why?
Links for this episode @ trinities.org/blog/podcast-280-have-yourself-an-incarnation-free-christmas
podcast 67 – Is Christmas a pagan holiday?
podcast 235 – The Case Against Preexistence
Clarifying Catholic Christologies
Christmas Amazement
World Religions 4a Hindu doctrines, schools, and history – Brahman, atman, and reincarnation
Birth of Krishna
a baby god – Ram (avatar of the god Vishnu) from Ramayana episode 1
World Religions 6a Life of the Buddha, Buddhist History – the life of Gautama part 1
Matthew 1-2; Luke 1-3; John 1; Philippians 2:5-7.
a reading of Philippians 2:5-11
Brown, The Birth of the Messiah
podcast 128 – Ehrman and Bird on How Jesus Became God – Part 1
podcast 227 – Who Should Christians Worship?
This week’s thinking music is “O Come All Ye Faithful (Adeste Fideles)” by the Canterbury Choir.
Weekly podcast exploring views about the Trinity, and more generally about God and Jesus in Christian theology and philosophy. Debates, interviews, and historical and contemporary perspectives. Hosted by philosopher of religion / analytic theologian Dr. Dale Tuggy.
This week's thinking music is "O Come All Ye Faithful (Adeste Fideles)" by the Canterbury Choir. archive.org/details/78_o-come-all-ye-faithful-adeste-fideles_the-canterbury-choir-macklin-marrow-ernest_gbia0006856a/O+Come+All+Ye+Faithful+(Adeste+Fide+-+The+Canterbury+Choir.flac
