Uploaded February 2023 | Updated September 2026, 19 hours ago

---

In this episode, I’m bringing you an interview with Dr. James Madden, professor of philosophy at Benedictine University. He is a martial artist, fitness coach, and philosopher with particular interest in the philosophy of mind, aesthetics, philosophy of religion, Aristotelianism, and phenomenology.

If you’ll recall from the last episode, Diana mentioned Dr. Madden as someone who shared her “spooky” interpretation of the Cave. I first met Jim when he was a speaker in one of Diana’s classes over the summer on this subject, and I really enjoyed learning from him. He has a really coherent way of placing the Cave within its proper context both within Plato’s Republic and within its historical context that opens up these ideas in inspiring and challenging ways.

So that’s where we’ll start, with an hour-long deep dive into Plato’s Cave, and what it implies for the nature of both reality and the UFO phenomenon. And then in the second half of the interview, we’ll turn to Dr. Madden’s latest philosophical work with regard to the phenomenon including what Heidegger reveals to us about the life and work of Godfather of Modern Ufology, Jaques Vallee, what Aristotle’s natural theology suggests about the potential nature of non-human intelligence, and how that work is being continued in the modern day by Dr. Jeffrey Kripal of Rice University. And finally, we’ll explore Dr. Madden’s fascinating hypothesis for the origins of the UFO phenomenon through the concept of the “umwelt”.

I hope you all enjoy this conversation as much as I enjoyed having it. This is my longest episode to date because we were having such a blast that I completely lost track of time. And when I went back to listen again, there wasn’t anything that I wanted to cut out. If you enjoy wading out into the deep end of the UFO phenomenon, this episode is for you.

LISTEN TO THESE EPISODES FIRST
If these ideas are new to you, you might find it helpful to go back and listen to the previous two episodes to get greater context.
Ep 16: The Sky Calls To Us: The Occult Origins Of The Space Race: youtu.be/cqxTdDdrjGU
Ep 17: An Interview with Dr. Diana Walsh Pasulka: youtu.be/rnbPV8cfYUY

GO TO EPISODE BRIEF FOR ALL RESOURCES MENTIONED IN THE EPISODE: bit.ly/ep18-notes

FIND MORE OF DR. JAMES MADDEN’S WORK

Dr. James Madden’s Website: jdmadden.com
Dr. James Madden’s Substack: jdmadden.substack.com
Online Course: Heidegger’s The Question Concerning Technology: jmadden.gumroad.com/l/trnat
UFO Realism and the Uber-Umwelt: jdmadden.substack.com/p/ufo-realism-and-the-uber-umwelt
Aristotle, Myth, and Extraterrestrial Intelligences: jdmadden.substack.com/p/aristotle-myth-and-extraterrestrial

BECOME A PATRON: patreon.com/uforabbithole

GET THE BOOK: ​​https://a.co/d/gQkAKaR

FOLLOW
Website: uforabbithole.com
Twitter: twitter.com/ufo_rabbit_hole
Facebook: facebook.com/uforabbithole

MUSIC
Theme: Cabinet of Curiosities by Shaun Frearson
Music Break: Golden Hour by Jonas Kolberg