Uploaded September 2026 | Updated September 2026, 41 minutes ago
Twenty-Five Years Later, the Fear Is Still Running the Country
The twin towers fell twenty-five years ago, but the outrage that moment spurred is still shaping life in the U.S. and beyond.
Kristin Du Mez, Diana Butler Bass, and Robert P. Jones sit with the anniversary and ask: What became of this country that morning?
You’ll hear where each of them was, including Kristin standing in a blood donation line that evening that turned out to be unnecessary, because there were almost no survivors.
Then, Robbie brings PRRI’s tracking of American attitudes toward Islam, where the country as a whole has barely moved while the two parties have pulled further and further apart.
Diana argues the goodwill drained the moment the president stood on the rubble and chose revenge over imagination. Robbie points to the creation of the Department of Homeland Security. And the fact that the first community ICE went after was Somali refugees who were Black and Muslim.
As we often do, we end with small signs of hope.
Earlier in the hour you’ll get Wild Goose, book launch season, and the books that changed their lives.
If you have wondered how we ended up in the country we are living in, this conversation is a large part of the answer.
Listen, then send it to someone who still can’t trace the line from the past to the present.
Follow on BlueSky:
https://bsky.app/profile/jemartisby.b...
https://bsky.app/profile/kkdumez.bsky...
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Follow on Substack:
The Convocation- convocation.substack.com
Robert P. Jones- whitetoolong.net
Diana Butler Bass- dianabutlerbass.substack.com
Kristin Du Mez- kristindumez.substack.com
Jemar Tisby- JemarTisby.Substack.com
Twenty-Five Years Later, the Fear Is Still Running the Country
The twin towers fell twenty-five years ago, but the outrage that moment spurred is still shaping life in the U.S. and beyond.
Kristin Du Mez, Diana Butler Bass, and Robert P. Jones sit with the anniversary and ask: What became of this country that morning?
You’ll hear where each of them was, including Kristin standing in a blood donation line that evening that turned out to be unnecessary, because there were almost no survivors.
Then, Robbie brings PRRI’s tracking of American attitudes toward Islam, where the country as a whole has barely moved while the two parties have pulled further and further apart.
Diana argues the goodwill drained the moment the president stood on the rubble and chose revenge over imagination. Robbie points to the creation of the Department of Homeland Security. And the fact that the first community ICE went after was Somali refugees who were Black and Muslim.
As we often do, we end with small signs of hope.
Earlier in the hour you’ll get Wild Goose, book launch season, and the books that changed their lives.
If you have wondered how we ended up in the country we are living in, this conversation is a large part of the answer.
Listen, then send it to someone who still can’t trace the line from the past to the present.
Follow on BlueSky:
https://bsky.app/profile/jemartisby.b...
https://bsky.app/profile/kkdumez.bsky...
https://bsky.app/profile/dianabutlerb...
https://bsky.app/profile/robertpjones...
Follow on Substack:
The Convocation- convocation.substack.com
Robert P. Jones- whitetoolong.net
Diana Butler Bass- dianabutlerbass.substack.com
Kristin Du Mez- kristindumez.substack.com
Jemar Tisby- JemarTisby.Substack.com
