Uploaded August 2025 | Updated September 2026, 2 days ago
Johnny Collins / George Collins / Young Collins / Giles Collins / Lady Alice (Child No. 85) Clerk Colven / Clerk Colvill (Child No. 42) - Sung by "Uncle" Lee Monroe Presnell (1875–1963, then aged 86) of Beech Mountain, Avery and Watauga County, North Carolina, USA. He learned the song from his mother, Louisa Jane "Eliza" Harmon Presnell (1828–1898), also of Beech Mountain. Recorded by Sandy Paton in the autumn of 1961. From "The Traditional Music of Beech Mountain, North Carolina, Vol. 1" (1964) Folk-Legacy – FSA-22.
Note by Kevin W.:
Prof. Francis James Child titled this ballad Lady Alice (Child 85) and he didn't think much of it as all five texts known to him told a brief "boy dies, sweetheart dies of grief" story written in a burlesque style. It wasn't until the 20th century that more complete texts were collected from singers in Virginia, West Virginia and Pennsylvania in America since 1916 and in Hampshire and Suffolk in England since 1906. These texts shed a new light on the song, preserving the outlines of a more complex story.
A man (named George, Johnny, Giles or Young Collins) encounters a strange woman at a riverside washing a marble stone or a silken cloth. She commands him to come to her for his life will end soon. He jumps into the water and embraces and kisses her. We aren't told what happens between them. Next we find Collins riding (or swimming) home to his parents, asking for a cloth to bind his head, predicting his death the same night and requesting to be buried at the marble stone under his lover's hill or under her hall. His lover, (named Eleanor, Ellender, Fair Ellen or Lady Alice), sits in her room sewing silk or being dressed in silk. When she sees pallbearers passing by she enquires the dead man's name. Being told that it is Collins, her old true love, she requests his coffin be set down and opened. She kisses his cold lips one last time and dies of grief soon after.
There is considerable confusion over the identity of the mysterious woman washing at a riverside in most American Collins texts. Singers couldn't make sense of her and naturally concluded that she must be the same person as Collins' true lover, Fair Ellen. This is not the case as becomes clear by comparing the following story.
The song appears to go back to an earlier Scottish ballad known as Clerk Colvill (Child 42) in which Colvill's lady warns him to stay away from the mermaid at the stream. But he goes there anyways as he has done many times before. The mermaid sits at the stream washing her silken cloth. She welcomes him with pleasure. A part of the story is missing, we aren't told what happens between them. Judging from similar Scandinavian ballads (such as the Danish Elveskud) we may assume he revealed to her that he now has a lady love and intends to marry her, so he can no longer come to visit. As the ballad continues Colvill complains about a headache. The mermaid tells him to cut a piece off her silken cloth and wrap it around his head to ease the pain. He does so upon which the pain increases even more. She tells him that it will get worse until he dies. He strikes at her with his sword but she turns into a fish and swims away. Weakened he rides home to his parents and dies soon after. The ballad of Clerk Colvill (Child 42) ends where the burlesque Lady Alice (Child 85) begins.
As for how an ancient and seemingly little known Scottish supernatural ballad could be remade into the present song of which no proper text was recorded before the 20th century any guess is as good as mine. It seems clear that the longer Collins texts predate Prof. Child's burlesque Lady Alice and evolved out of or alongside Clerk Colvill in some way or another. No Collins texts were found in Scotland. At least three fragmentary texts (Maud Karpeles in 1929, Kenneth Peacock in 1952) were collected in Newfoundland, Canada. The existence of an Irish tradition at some earlier date is implied by the mention of Dublin town in American texts but none have been reported from there.
All the full Collins texts being similar but in varying states of corruption suggests a long circulation in oral tradition and a print origin. A broadside print seems likely but so far none has been found. Its origin and true meaning remain a mystery.
An excellent article on the American Johnny Collins texts was written by Pennsylvania born folklorist Samuel Preston Bayard (1908–1997): bluegrassmessengers.com/the-johnny-collins-version-of-lady-alice--bayard-.aspx
Johnny Collins / George Collins / Young Collins / Giles Collins / Lady Alice (Child No. 85) Clerk Colven / Clerk Colvill (Child No. 42) - Sung by "Uncle" Lee Monroe Presnell (1875–1963, then aged 86) of Beech Mountain, Avery and Watauga County, North Carolina, USA. He learned the song from his mother, Louisa Jane "Eliza" Harmon Presnell (1828–1898), also of Beech Mountain. Recorded by Sandy Paton in the autumn of 1961. From "The Traditional Music of Beech Mountain, North Carolina, Vol. 1" (1964) Folk-Legacy – FSA-22.
Note by Kevin W.:
Prof. Francis James Child titled this ballad Lady Alice (Child 85) and he didn't think much of it as all five texts known to him told a brief "boy dies, sweetheart dies of grief" story written in a burlesque style. It wasn't until the 20th century that more complete texts were collected from singers in Virginia, West Virginia and Pennsylvania in America since 1916 and in Hampshire and Suffolk in England since 1906. These texts shed a new light on the song, preserving the outlines of a more complex story.
A man (named George, Johnny, Giles or Young Collins) encounters a strange woman at a riverside washing a marble stone or a silken cloth. She commands him to come to her for his life will end soon. He jumps into the water and embraces and kisses her. We aren't told what happens between them. Next we find Collins riding (or swimming) home to his parents, asking for a cloth to bind his head, predicting his death the same night and requesting to be buried at the marble stone under his lover's hill or under her hall. His lover, (named Eleanor, Ellender, Fair Ellen or Lady Alice), sits in her room sewing silk or being dressed in silk. When she sees pallbearers passing by she enquires the dead man's name. Being told that it is Collins, her old true love, she requests his coffin be set down and opened. She kisses his cold lips one last time and dies of grief soon after.
There is considerable confusion over the identity of the mysterious woman washing at a riverside in most American Collins texts. Singers couldn't make sense of her and naturally concluded that she must be the same person as Collins' true lover, Fair Ellen. This is not the case as becomes clear by comparing the following story.
The song appears to go back to an earlier Scottish ballad known as Clerk Colvill (Child 42) in which Colvill's lady warns him to stay away from the mermaid at the stream. But he goes there anyways as he has done many times before. The mermaid sits at the stream washing her silken cloth. She welcomes him with pleasure. A part of the story is missing, we aren't told what happens between them. Judging from similar Scandinavian ballads (such as the Danish Elveskud) we may assume he revealed to her that he now has a lady love and intends to marry her, so he can no longer come to visit. As the ballad continues Colvill complains about a headache. The mermaid tells him to cut a piece off her silken cloth and wrap it around his head to ease the pain. He does so upon which the pain increases even more. She tells him that it will get worse until he dies. He strikes at her with his sword but she turns into a fish and swims away. Weakened he rides home to his parents and dies soon after. The ballad of Clerk Colvill (Child 42) ends where the burlesque Lady Alice (Child 85) begins.
As for how an ancient and seemingly little known Scottish supernatural ballad could be remade into the present song of which no proper text was recorded before the 20th century any guess is as good as mine. It seems clear that the longer Collins texts predate Prof. Child's burlesque Lady Alice and evolved out of or alongside Clerk Colvill in some way or another. No Collins texts were found in Scotland. At least three fragmentary texts (Maud Karpeles in 1929, Kenneth Peacock in 1952) were collected in Newfoundland, Canada. The existence of an Irish tradition at some earlier date is implied by the mention of Dublin town in American texts but none have been reported from there.
All the full Collins texts being similar but in varying states of corruption suggests a long circulation in oral tradition and a print origin. A broadside print seems likely but so far none has been found. Its origin and true meaning remain a mystery.
An excellent article on the American Johnny Collins texts was written by Pennsylvania born folklorist Samuel Preston Bayard (1908–1997): bluegrassmessengers.com/the-johnny-collins-version-of-lady-alice--bayard-.aspx
