Uploaded March 2026 | Updated September 2026, 2 weeks ago
Welcome back to Part 35 of our series with Dr. John Turner discussing his new book “Joseph Smith: The Rise and Fall of an American Prophet.”
In 1843, Joseph Smith began introducing some of his closest family members – including his wife Emma Smith and his brother Hyrum Smith –to the controversial and secretive practice of plural marriage.
This episode dives into one of the most complex and debated periods of early Latter-day Saint history. We explore the story of the Kinderhook Plates –a set of six brass plates that briefly captured Joseph Smith’s attention before being exposed as a fraud –and what that moment reveals about claims of translation and discernment.
We also examine the marriages to the Partridge sisters, the dynamics between Joseph and Emma, and the growing theological framework surrounding celestial marriage, “calling and election made sure,” and eternal hierarchy. As new doctrines emerged, secrecy, trust, and power became deeply intertwined.
This episode raises difficult questions such as: What happened to the Kinderhook Plates –and why didn’t the translation continue? How did plural marriage unfold behind the scenes? What did Joseph teach privately vs publicly? How did those closest to him respond about polygamy?
This is a careful, long-form discussion intended to slow down and examine the historical record in detail.
If you’d like to help keep this project going, please consider donating to support this series. Your support makes long-form, in-depth historical discussion like this possible!
donorbox.org/josephsmith.
Purchase John Turner’s book here: https://yalebooks.yale.edu/book/9780300255164/joseph-smith/
Let us know your thoughts on a Brigham Young series (comprising ten episodes) covering John Turner’s book Brigham Young: Pioneer Prophet.
Show notes can be found on the Mormon Stories blog here: osfoundation.slack.com/archives/C02NR07ENA2/p1774563817817159
Timecodes:
00:00:00 - Introduction
00:04:57 - Kinderhook Plates
00:11:29 - Photo of Kinderhook plate
00:14:17 - Plates are admitted frauds
00:33:03 - Why did he not finish the translation?
00:40:22 - Calling and Election Made Sure
00:45:00 - Levels in the Celestial Kingdom
00:55:23 - BJ’s bed
00:58:12 - Esther Johnson
01:01:16 - Eternal increase
01:15:34 - Emma and Hyrum unaware of polygamy
01:25:04 - Emma selects Partridge sisters
01:26:47 - Sham marriage
01:36:33 - How did Emma and Hyrum not know?
01:50:46 - New and Everlasting Covenant
01:52:50 - Polygamy for Time only
01:55:42 - Mary Fielding Smith
01:58:29 - Joseph Smith’s confession
02:03:14 - Closing Remarks
___________________
At Mormon Stories we explore, celebrate, and challenge Mormon culture through in-depth stories told by members and former members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as well as scholars, authors, LDS apologists, and other professionals.
Our overall mission is to:
1. Facilitate informed consent amongst LDS Church members, investigators, and non-members regarding Mormon history, doctrine, and theology
2. Support Mormons (and members of other high-demand religions) who are experiencing a religious faith crisis
3. Promote healing, growth and community for those who choose to leave the LDS Church or other high demand religions
🤝Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today
One-time or recurring donations: donorbox.org/mormon-stories?default_interval=m
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Our Platforms:
🌐Mormon Stories Blog: mormonstories.org/episodes
🎙️Patreon: patreon.com/mormonstories
✳️Spotify: open.spotify.com/show/4sDzk7dRjODTSEqzZKZJzk?si=148b0efc1ccc4404&nd=1
🍎Apple Podcasts: podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/mormon-stories-lds/id312094772
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📱TikTok: tiktok.com/@mormonstoriespodcast
🎮Discord: discord.com/invite/kuX5p6yyjF
Contact us:
📧 MormonStories@gmail.com
📬PO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117
Welcome back to Part 35 of our series with Dr. John Turner discussing his new book “Joseph Smith: The Rise and Fall of an American Prophet.”
In 1843, Joseph Smith began introducing some of his closest family members – including his wife Emma Smith and his brother Hyrum Smith –to the controversial and secretive practice of plural marriage.
This episode dives into one of the most complex and debated periods of early Latter-day Saint history. We explore the story of the Kinderhook Plates –a set of six brass plates that briefly captured Joseph Smith’s attention before being exposed as a fraud –and what that moment reveals about claims of translation and discernment.
We also examine the marriages to the Partridge sisters, the dynamics between Joseph and Emma, and the growing theological framework surrounding celestial marriage, “calling and election made sure,” and eternal hierarchy. As new doctrines emerged, secrecy, trust, and power became deeply intertwined.
This episode raises difficult questions such as: What happened to the Kinderhook Plates –and why didn’t the translation continue? How did plural marriage unfold behind the scenes? What did Joseph teach privately vs publicly? How did those closest to him respond about polygamy?
This is a careful, long-form discussion intended to slow down and examine the historical record in detail.
If you’d like to help keep this project going, please consider donating to support this series. Your support makes long-form, in-depth historical discussion like this possible!
donorbox.org/josephsmith.
Purchase John Turner’s book here: https://yalebooks.yale.edu/book/9780300255164/joseph-smith/
Let us know your thoughts on a Brigham Young series (comprising ten episodes) covering John Turner’s book Brigham Young: Pioneer Prophet.
Show notes can be found on the Mormon Stories blog here: osfoundation.slack.com/archives/C02NR07ENA2/p1774563817817159
Timecodes:
00:00:00 - Introduction
00:04:57 - Kinderhook Plates
00:11:29 - Photo of Kinderhook plate
00:14:17 - Plates are admitted frauds
00:33:03 - Why did he not finish the translation?
00:40:22 - Calling and Election Made Sure
00:45:00 - Levels in the Celestial Kingdom
00:55:23 - BJ’s bed
00:58:12 - Esther Johnson
01:01:16 - Eternal increase
01:15:34 - Emma and Hyrum unaware of polygamy
01:25:04 - Emma selects Partridge sisters
01:26:47 - Sham marriage
01:36:33 - How did Emma and Hyrum not know?
01:50:46 - New and Everlasting Covenant
01:52:50 - Polygamy for Time only
01:55:42 - Mary Fielding Smith
01:58:29 - Joseph Smith’s confession
02:03:14 - Closing Remarks
___________________
At Mormon Stories we explore, celebrate, and challenge Mormon culture through in-depth stories told by members and former members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as well as scholars, authors, LDS apologists, and other professionals.
Our overall mission is to:
1. Facilitate informed consent amongst LDS Church members, investigators, and non-members regarding Mormon history, doctrine, and theology
2. Support Mormons (and members of other high-demand religions) who are experiencing a religious faith crisis
3. Promote healing, growth and community for those who choose to leave the LDS Church or other high demand religions
🤝Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today
One-time or recurring donations: donorbox.org/mormon-stories?default_interval=m
Patreon: patreon.com/mormonstories
Venmo: account.venmo.com/u/mormonstories
Paypal: paypal.me/mormonstories
Join this channel to get access to perks:
youtube.com/channel/UCx6OgmoqJbOVRq-Lv1P7SzA/join
Our Platforms:
🌐Mormon Stories Blog: mormonstories.org/episodes
🎙️Patreon: patreon.com/mormonstories
✳️Spotify: open.spotify.com/show/4sDzk7dRjODTSEqzZKZJzk?si=148b0efc1ccc4404&nd=1
🍎Apple Podcasts: podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/mormon-stories-lds/id312094772
🖼️Instagram: instagram.com/mormstories
📱TikTok: tiktok.com/@mormonstoriespodcast
🎮Discord: discord.com/invite/kuX5p6yyjF
Contact us:
📧 MormonStories@gmail.com
📬PO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117
