Uploaded June 2026 | Updated September 2026, 1 week ago
In this episode Trent sits down with Michael Pagano of @TrueChristian to discuss his views on Catholicism.
Michael's website: truechristianministry.com
Michael's book: amzn.to/4a32DuS
Trent's Article on Revelation 12 - catholic.com/magazine/online-edition/is-mary-the-woman-in-revelation-12
To support this channel: patreon.com/counseloftrent
[NEW] Counsel of Trent merch: shop.catholic.com/apologists-alley/trent-horn-resources
Be sure to keep up with our socials!
tiktok.com/@counseloftrent
twitter.com/counseloftrent
instagram.com/counseloftrentpodcast
00:25 Introducing Michael Pagano
01:14 Why Catholic-Protestant dialogue matters
03:06 Christians behaving like Christians online
04:09 Salvation, works, and common ground
06:18 Michael’s Catholic upbringing
07:28 Michael’s conversion story
09:02 Scripture study and leaving Catholicism
10:06 Discovering sola Scriptura
11:12 Michael’s Protestant theology today
12:41 Calvinism, predestination, and Reformed Baptists
14:51 Why Catholicism and Reformed theology clash
15:19 Marian devotion and prayer to saints
20:08 The Assumption of Mary and binding dogma
22:17 What must Christians believe to be saved?
24:25 The Trinity, Virgin Birth, and revealed doctrine
27:49 How do we know what God revealed?
29:22 The canon, Hebrews, and Church authority
31:07 Reformation history and shared Christian roots
32:32 Latin Mass, Eastern Catholics, and global Catholicism
34:51 Apostles, succession, and authority in the Church
38:32 Biblical clarity, inerrancy, and salvation
41:25 The early Church, canon, and Catholic doctrine
42:42 Baptism, infants, and the Didache
45:22 The catacombs, purgatory, and the dead
46:18 Baptism debates and hyper-dispensationalism
48:27 Church authority and infallibility
56:17 Church Fathers and historical reliability
1:04:00 Online church vs. local church
1:05:10 Michael’s experience at the House of Mary
1:09:59 Trent’s experience with Marian devotion
1:12:16 Catholics, Protestants, and the gospel
1:13:21 Mary, the Assumption, and discipleship
1:15:34 Mary, sin, and grace
1:17:22 The Immaculate Conception
1:18:45 Marian typology and Revelation 12
1:21:11 Verse battles and deeper dialogue
1:22:13 The papacy and Revelation’s seven churches
1:24:07 Trent’s response on Rome and Clement
1:26:40 Atonement and Soteriology
1:35:13 Justification, grace, and sacraments
1:44:08 Eternal security and falling away
2:00:35 Closing thoughts and future conversations
In this episode Trent sits down with Michael Pagano of @TrueChristian to discuss his views on Catholicism.
Michael's website: truechristianministry.com
Michael's book: amzn.to/4a32DuS
Trent's Article on Revelation 12 - catholic.com/magazine/online-edition/is-mary-the-woman-in-revelation-12
To support this channel: patreon.com/counseloftrent
[NEW] Counsel of Trent merch: shop.catholic.com/apologists-alley/trent-horn-resources
Be sure to keep up with our socials!
tiktok.com/@counseloftrent
twitter.com/counseloftrent
instagram.com/counseloftrentpodcast
00:25 Introducing Michael Pagano
01:14 Why Catholic-Protestant dialogue matters
03:06 Christians behaving like Christians online
04:09 Salvation, works, and common ground
06:18 Michael’s Catholic upbringing
07:28 Michael’s conversion story
09:02 Scripture study and leaving Catholicism
10:06 Discovering sola Scriptura
11:12 Michael’s Protestant theology today
12:41 Calvinism, predestination, and Reformed Baptists
14:51 Why Catholicism and Reformed theology clash
15:19 Marian devotion and prayer to saints
20:08 The Assumption of Mary and binding dogma
22:17 What must Christians believe to be saved?
24:25 The Trinity, Virgin Birth, and revealed doctrine
27:49 How do we know what God revealed?
29:22 The canon, Hebrews, and Church authority
31:07 Reformation history and shared Christian roots
32:32 Latin Mass, Eastern Catholics, and global Catholicism
34:51 Apostles, succession, and authority in the Church
38:32 Biblical clarity, inerrancy, and salvation
41:25 The early Church, canon, and Catholic doctrine
42:42 Baptism, infants, and the Didache
45:22 The catacombs, purgatory, and the dead
46:18 Baptism debates and hyper-dispensationalism
48:27 Church authority and infallibility
56:17 Church Fathers and historical reliability
1:04:00 Online church vs. local church
1:05:10 Michael’s experience at the House of Mary
1:09:59 Trent’s experience with Marian devotion
1:12:16 Catholics, Protestants, and the gospel
1:13:21 Mary, the Assumption, and discipleship
1:15:34 Mary, sin, and grace
1:17:22 The Immaculate Conception
1:18:45 Marian typology and Revelation 12
1:21:11 Verse battles and deeper dialogue
1:22:13 The papacy and Revelation’s seven churches
1:24:07 Trent’s response on Rome and Clement
1:26:40 Atonement and Soteriology
1:35:13 Justification, grace, and sacraments
1:44:08 Eternal security and falling away
2:00:35 Closing thoughts and future conversations
