Uploaded September 2026 | Updated September 2026, 4 days ago
This week we’re having a long-overdue reunion with John T. Harvey, known to our listeners as the Cowboy Economist because of his plainspoken, accessible way of explaining complex ideas. John talks with Steve about his latest book, US Business Cycles 1954–2020. The conversation challenges mainstream economic theory that treats markets as naturally self-correcting, when in fact unemployment, inequality, oligarchy, and recurring crises are outcomes generated by the system itself.
The discussion brings MMT’s insights about money and real resources into direct contact with the question of class power. If the federal government can finance full employment, and a Job Guarantee could give workers a genuine alternative to precarious private employment, why don’t we do it? John and Steve agree on the central contradiction: the obstacles are not primarily economic or technical. They lie in the distribution of power and in institutions structured around the interests of capital. The challenge, then, is not simply figuring out what is economically possible, but understanding what prevents us from doing it.
John T. Harvey is the Hal Wright Professor of Economics in the Department of Economics at Texas Christian University. He is a well-known heterodox scholar who has published extensively, including two books: Currencies, Crises and Capital Flows (2009) and Contending Perspectives in Economics (2020 2nd edition). His most recent book is US Business Cycles 1954–2020, published by Cambridge University Press (December 2025). He has earned numerous awards for teaching and research, and his work focuses on exchange rates and business cycles.
On Twitter: @John_T_Harvey
On YouTube, you can find John under the pseudonym The Cowboy Economist. @cowboyeconomist8126
00:00 Welcome John Harvey
02:00 Punk and Reeducation
05:21 Why This Book Exists
07:08 Capitalism as the Problem
09:34 MBA to Marxist Pivot
17:23 Institutions and Power
19:46 Unemployment by Design
20:47 Economism and Red Scare
27:20 MMT and Paying For It
30:59 WWII Bonds and Inflation
33:41 Motives And Class Power
35:18 Wealth Means Freedom
36:16 Trusting Authority Story
37:36 Economics Assumes Full Employment
40:17 Cultural Hegemony In Media
44:26 Job Guarantee Explained
46:11 Why Capital Fights It
47:40 Selling Policy Across Ideology
51:21 Power Not Economics
54:23 Hope And Alternatives
55:39 Wrap Up And Where To Find
59:43 Support The Podcast
Weaponize Knowledge with Modern Monetary Theory (MMT)
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We believe all materials used in this video fall under Fair Use as defined in Section 107 of the Copyright Act of 1976.
#mmt
Weaponize Knowledge with Modern Monetary Theory (MMT)
Please help our Real Progressives efforts in spreading and become a monthly donor!
At PayPal
paypal.me/RealProgressives/25
At Patreon
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Write for Real Progressives
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Visit our website:
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Listen to our podcast:
realprogressives.org/macro-n-cheese-podcast
We believe all materials used in this video fall under Fair Use as defined in Section 107 of the Copyright Act of 1976.
This week we’re having a long-overdue reunion with John T. Harvey, known to our listeners as the Cowboy Economist because of his plainspoken, accessible way of explaining complex ideas. John talks with Steve about his latest book, US Business Cycles 1954–2020. The conversation challenges mainstream economic theory that treats markets as naturally self-correcting, when in fact unemployment, inequality, oligarchy, and recurring crises are outcomes generated by the system itself.
The discussion brings MMT’s insights about money and real resources into direct contact with the question of class power. If the federal government can finance full employment, and a Job Guarantee could give workers a genuine alternative to precarious private employment, why don’t we do it? John and Steve agree on the central contradiction: the obstacles are not primarily economic or technical. They lie in the distribution of power and in institutions structured around the interests of capital. The challenge, then, is not simply figuring out what is economically possible, but understanding what prevents us from doing it.
John T. Harvey is the Hal Wright Professor of Economics in the Department of Economics at Texas Christian University. He is a well-known heterodox scholar who has published extensively, including two books: Currencies, Crises and Capital Flows (2009) and Contending Perspectives in Economics (2020 2nd edition). His most recent book is US Business Cycles 1954–2020, published by Cambridge University Press (December 2025). He has earned numerous awards for teaching and research, and his work focuses on exchange rates and business cycles.
On Twitter: @John_T_Harvey
On YouTube, you can find John under the pseudonym The Cowboy Economist. @cowboyeconomist8126
00:00 Welcome John Harvey
02:00 Punk and Reeducation
05:21 Why This Book Exists
07:08 Capitalism as the Problem
09:34 MBA to Marxist Pivot
17:23 Institutions and Power
19:46 Unemployment by Design
20:47 Economism and Red Scare
27:20 MMT and Paying For It
30:59 WWII Bonds and Inflation
33:41 Motives And Class Power
35:18 Wealth Means Freedom
36:16 Trusting Authority Story
37:36 Economics Assumes Full Employment
40:17 Cultural Hegemony In Media
44:26 Job Guarantee Explained
46:11 Why Capital Fights It
47:40 Selling Policy Across Ideology
51:21 Power Not Economics
54:23 Hope And Alternatives
55:39 Wrap Up And Where To Find
59:43 Support The Podcast
Weaponize Knowledge with Modern Monetary Theory (MMT)
Please help our Real Progressives efforts in spreading and become a monthly donor!
At PayPal
paypal.me/RealProgressives/25
At Patreon
patreon.com/realprogressives
Donorbox
donorbox.org/each-one-teach-one-3
Write for Real Progressives
realprogressives.org/submit-an-article
Visit our website:
realprogressives.org
Listen to our podcast:
realprogressives.org/macro-n-cheese-podcast
Subscribe to our Substack:
realprogressives.substack.com
We believe all materials used in this video fall under Fair Use as defined in Section 107 of the Copyright Act of 1976.
#mmt
Weaponize Knowledge with Modern Monetary Theory (MMT)
Please help our Real Progressives efforts in spreading and become a monthly donor!
At PayPal
paypal.me/RealProgressives/25
At Patreon
patreon.com/realprogressives
Write for Real Progressives
realprogressives.org/submit-an-article
Visit our website:
realprogressives.org
Listen to our podcast:
realprogressives.org/macro-n-cheese-podcast
We believe all materials used in this video fall under Fair Use as defined in Section 107 of the Copyright Act of 1976.
